Congratulations to the IAMAW Local Lodge 933 for winning this week’s Decertification Petition. A proper salute, in all fairness goes to the Union. Have your party now. Dance, drink and be merry. There is no hate. Today we are celebrating Labor Day where I respectfully take my hat off to Jimbo and the whole team he leads and offer congratulations.
As we have finished our campaign messages, we will continue to observe and comment on the direction the Union takes our labor force. We will criticize if we feel it’s needed. We’ll compliment when it’s appropriate. We’ll take on the role of watchdog for now, so we are not going away. As this entire campaign has been political in nature, we hope that nobody had their feeling too hurt. I plan to put my political hat in a corner for now and let the negotiation process take place.
Thank you Jeff, for an excellent debate. I read the comment section and do not feel an apology is in order. Congratulations are in order for your contribution to IAM933’s cause. Your constant arguments were in the best interest of your side and you represented your position very well. Although I don’t agree with you philosophically, I gather from your passion that you truly believe you work in the best interest of others. I wished that I had the chance to debate with members of the local at the level that you brought here to these pages. You truly are a champion of your cause.
Keep your eyes on November. If Jimbo takes our messages seriously, he will fix the problems that caused this rebellion. So enjoy your victory. Majority rules, remember? We'll kindly remind you of our ideas in October if we feel the need. For the next two months, your team can feel free to tell us what positive things your side is doing for the entire labor force. Lead by example. We’re all eyes and ears.
As a final comment, I present a challenge. A very important comment was made this weekend anonymously. A couple hundred signatures are not enough someone said. You're right. But it's a start. Welcome to your new reality. There are hundreds who voted against you. What are you going to do to correct the problem? We will not hate. In this pluralistic society, there is room for differing ideas. But with the helm of an organization responsible for the well being of all the labor force, you have a big job ahead of you. I offer to answer in good faith any serious questions you may have that would lead to the resolution of the crisis you face.
55 comments:
Yeah, right.
Give me a break. Parti boy, you are too much. Hilarious!
The union isn't going to celebrate, there's nothing to celebrate. You never had any support, and your petitions are completely without merit. You are unimportant.
You say "we hope that nobody had their feeling too hurt." That translates to "Hey, I lied to everyone! No big deal!"
Here's the bottom line: You are a liar! No one is going to buy your conciliatory tone now. Look back over the lies you told, how you had "boxes and boxes" of petitions, you were going to count them over the weekend...
"May God have mercy on your soul," you said. You are a Christian. How do you think God looked upon your invoking His name in your lies, when you knew you didn't have enough signatures? You will have to answer for that one day.
You knew you never had enough. You knew it months ago. Yet you continued to lie, how you were going to bring down this union, yadda yadda yadda.
Look, it may be that you think that lying for politics is perfectly acceptable. Well, we're just working people. We don't think it's right to lie for any reason, or to unfairly smear good people who are doing what they believe is the right thing. I guess it's easy to go after good, honest people when you are more than willing to lie every day through your teeth.
Yes you've lied, you've smeared, you've called us communists and socialists. You've called us criminals, and thugs and accused us of violent acts.
You didn't get enough signatures, not near enough. We called you on your lies. You say it's because we're intimidating them. No, it's because they saw through your lies. You hate those who you feel are beneath you, and you told us how most of the workers in the unit are overpaid, and you are underpaid. So, your solution is to get rid of the union, so their wages will drop and yours will rise.
Great plan.
You now say you will take on the role of a watchdog. Wrong. You were dishonest throughout this campaign, lying about the union and the people in it. You are a liar, and therefore are incapable of actually being a watchdog. We all know your goal is not a better union or better workplace, it's the destruction of all unions, you just had wet dreams you could start with this one.
You said "A very important comment was made this weekend anonymously. A couple hundred signatures are not enough someone said. You're right. But it's a start."
You are wrong. Your couple of hundred signatures isn't a start, it's the end. The end of the road for your crusade. You made big promises, and you couldn't deliver.
And you continue to lie. If you REALLY mean what you say in this post, take down iam933.net. Withdraw all NLRB actions and petitions. Delete all your posts on this blog attacking the union.
Start over. If you really meant what you said in this post, that's what you'd do.
Once again... WOW!!!! Sounds like there are others out there that feel Slim was in it only for himself.
Slim, why haven't you posted anything in regards to your numbers???? The true numbers.
I have a feeling that everyone you work with now sees your true colors. Good luck with that now Slim. See, you will have to work with these people every day. People you decided were overpaid, communists, socialists, etc... I bet you have no idea how many of these people you pissed off.
You claimed the Union has done nothing but lie to you. Well Slim, you told many lies all during this futile campaign. You expect the Union to make amends, but what about you Slim????
I just want to wish all the working men and women out there a very Happy Labour Day. Remember Labour History is OUR HISTORY!
Oh, and buy American!!!!!!
As always,
Jeff
GO IAM!!!!!
Wow dude, you really bit his head off. He came on here and gave a graceful message accepting loss.
You look like a sore winner. That's pathetic. People like you hurt the union. That makes you worse than him. You want him to remove his messages and all? You first.
"Wow dude, you really bit his head off. He came on here and gave a graceful message accepting loss.
You look like a sore winner. That's pathetic. People like you hurt the union. That makes you worse than him. You want him to remove his messages and all? You first."
Give me a break. If he'd have came here and said "I'm sorry, I've wrote some things that were not true, and I apologize for them, and for all the baiting and name-calling and personal attacks I've done" he would have gotten a pass.
But I remember "I have boxes and boxes of petitions, may God have mercy on your soul".
I remember parti boy taking union flyers and putting the hammer and sickle all over them.
Yes, he should remove ALL the posts and their comments, if he wants to start over.
Once again, this isn't a start, it's the END of the line for parti boy's crusade against unionism. He's had his chance, and no one listened to him. The vast majority of people here want a union, and it's not because they are socialists or communists. It's because they are Americans, and unions are American.
He's called us names for three years. He's questioned our patriotism.
So, until he retracts the statements and apologizes, he gets no pass.
Oh, stop.
Eat a free hot-dog and chill out, R.
"So, until he retracts the statements and apologizes, he gets no pass."
I agree. For three years it's been a constant union bashing. I myself argued that the hourly decide how the union works with their vote. You ousties kept saying it was the leaders fault. Well I think the hourly showed you ousties exactly how they feel. WE WANT OUR UNION!!! Hopefully Willie and his poor boys now get the message that WE are the union.
Oh and that hot dog was awesome thanks.
Go Union
This is my favorite part:
Obama spent a good deal of his time extolling the virtues of the union movement.
"We remember that the rights and benefits we enjoy today were not simply handed out to America's working men and women. They had to be won," he said.
"They had to be fought for, by men and women of courage and conviction, from the factory floors of the Industrial Revolution to the shopping aisles of today's superstores. They stood up and spoke out to demand a fair shake, an honest day's pay for an honest day's work," he said. "Many risked their lives. Some gave their lives. Some made it a cause of their lives -- like Sen. Ted Kennedy, who we remember today."
Congratulations to IAM933.
Jeff, good choice of words. Feel implies what Slim didn't say. He never was in it for himself. He said he was against others taking what is his. Just because you won doesn't mean everyone agrees with you. To the others, if you want your union, save it by not being greedy.
The thin skinned people on here hating Slim personally ain't got no ground to defend. So he called the Union commies, and all that. Have you ever seen a political ad in America?
The contest is over. Get over it. It went both ways on this blog. Most of it wasn't even cut out. Go read your own words and ask if Slim is alone. He just kept talking smack until you all responded. Stop the hating. What goes around...
The labor is broken for years. Do you want it split? You tough guys lighten up. The following link is for information only. Your own webmaster put this in May of 08. Is a split what you want?
There are pro union ousties. Does that supprise you? It shouldn't. These were the ones who spoke loudest against THIS union. Ramon said this union is perparing to right the past. Time will tell. Ramon, what positive things do you have to say?
Jeff
Just who are you really? I detect a note of personal interest in your questions with their effort. As if to say you are quite directly vested in lodge 933. Superbia did concede with honor. You however will not let up. Is this the example of a kinder and friendlier union? I am just an observer following your blogs and thus got wrapped into them. I am represented by a nurses union we wish to decertify and I need some notes. I hope the blogs continue.
Regards- Jill in CA.
Hats off to Oust933
Angry Crack head notes deleted. Blog moderated. Maybe someone can answer Jill after Mr "I'm so butthurt" goes to sleep. Thanks for understanding. Sorry Jill.
I'll be back tomorrow to answer real blogs, and erase ones with gasps for air while they swallow.
I am represented by a nurses union we wish to decertify and I need some notes. I hope the blogs continue.
Regards- Jill in CA.
So what city are you from and what union represents you Jill?
As I have stated numerous times before, I do not work at Raytheon. Nor am I affiliated in any way with Local 933, other than being a member of the IAM. I do not reside in a right to work for less state, so that should narrow it down a little bit.
I am just an interested Union member that has watched this campaign for over a year. I have seen all the mud slinging going on here by Slim and some other of the "ousties".
I am happy to see that the "ousties" campaign fail. And fail miserably. Or that is my best guess since Slim will not post the numbers.
On many occasions I saw Slim post things about how his classification was underpaid and how other classifications got raises even though they didn't deserve it. And when the numbers didn't go his way, he said they might try to go out on their own. Just his classification. Now tell me that is not Slim looking out for himself?!?!?!?!?
I will continue to check this blog from time to time. Just to see what is going on.
I firmly believe that Slim and the other "ousties" need to join the Union and be a part of your future. Get involved. If the "ousties" are so passionate, all of you need to join, go to the meetings and when the time come you need to run for office and oust those that you want. Your voice will have to be heard then. Give it a shot and see what happens. Do not just sit back and complain about things. If you are not part of the solution, then you are part of the problem.
As always,
Jeff
GO IAM!!!!!!!!
"I firmly believe that Slim and the other "ousties" need to join the Union and be a part of your future. Get involved. If the "ousties" are so passionate, all of you need to join, go to the meetings and when the time come you need to run for office and oust those that you want. Your voice will have to be heard then. Give it a shot and see what happens. Do not just sit back and complain about things. If you are not part of the solution, then you are part of the problem.
As always,
Jeff
GO IAM!!!!!!!!"
Out of respect and curiosity,for the issues that SP has said he wants fixed (and the fact I don't believe the company will give anything back without taking something else away)I think it would be interesting if you Jeff and SP would role play in the form of blogging, how those things would be negotiated. Jeff you could play the part of the company and SP take the role of the union negotiators. I really would like to see how you guys would pull this off, I think others who have followed may enjoy it as well. Mind you you would have to come to an agreement,on way or another. Are you guys game?
Other bloggers you would have NO SAY SO in ANY of it!!!!
Cool request. But I think it would be much too complicated and drawn out to actually perform that here on a nine word wide column. There are literally dozens of issues to negotiate and it's just not practical for this blog.
No Jeff, again I tell you I am not in it for myself, unless you of course, are Steve. You aren't Steve right? I am not in it for myself neither. There are hundreds of us dissatisfied with the status quo, but I digress. I’m done talking about that for a couple months. But on a similar subject, the Stewards are out asking for people to bring their concerns to the next meeting on Ajo Way.
I ask any Union members who share some of the concerns I have expressed about the technical trades to go speak up. Go see your Steward and make sure you can express your opinion at the meeting this Sunday. Jeff suggested, and I now advise, all you blog-curious union members to get down to Ajo way and give this process a whirl. Be there this time, and next time too! Force them to hear your concerns!
I will remain out of the fray, simply to not distract from the conversation at Union Hall. I will observe and comment, only because this is too important. If any of the officers want my input, they can write me a note. Since I don’t belong to the union, I seriously doubt they want to hear from me. And that’s fine. But I’m willing to give input in good faith if they ask. E-mail the webmaster on iam933.net, and I’ll get the message eventually.
Anon. Sep 8 9:16pm. Nice idea to negotiate here, but this format leaves too much to be desired.
Jeff: "Your voice will have to be heard then. Give it a shot and see what happens. Do not just sit back and complain about things."
Oh, I have a good feeling that our concerns were noted; by the union and by the company. For free; no dues required!
I also find it interesting that up until a couple of months ago, an hourly employee could take a promotion into a salaried position, but that is now no longer the case.
Why do you think that was put into place?
"I also find it interesting that up until a couple of months ago, an hourly employee could take a promotion into a salaried position, but that is now no longer the case.
Why do you think that was put into place?"
This ought to be interesting. Why can't an hourly move up into a salary position?
"This ought to be interesting. Why can't an hourly move up into a salary position?"
Go ask our worthy Ops V.P. that question for yourself. Too many of them have been escaping to better positions, perhaps?
You weren't at that meeting he had a few weeks ago?
"Go ask our worthy Ops V.P. that question for yourself. Too many of them have been escaping to better positions, perhaps?
You weren't at that meeting he had a few weeks ago?"
No I work for a living. So what did he say? what were his words? Did anyone else hear that?
Awful quiet around here.
Quiet
How original Ramon. Didn't someone do that to you a few days ago? Everyone knows you learned how to add an href to the blog just a few days ago. SP is waiting for you to call him and talk shop. Why don't you? You want him on your contract negotiation team? Huh? Huh? Huh?
"How original Ramon. Didn't someone do that to you a few days ago? Everyone knows you learned how to add an href to the blog just a few days ago. SP is waiting for you to call him and talk shop. Why don't you? You want him on your contract negotiation team? Huh? Huh? Huh?"
hehehehehe you have no idea who I am. So i'm still waiting to hear about hourly folks not getting promoted because I know differently.
I hear talk going on about that labor day letter. Members cant believe SP would do that. It is not like him. He tipped his hat to the union. Now look at the first reply and many more. Is this what our union looks like to them? Jeff, do you really expect them to join us now?
"So i'm still waiting to hear about hourly folks not getting promoted because I know differently."
Really? Info I've heard about comes from some reliable sources (as in, more than three; at least one was VSM-level or above) I'm willing to believe they're accurate. How's the credibility of your source?
"Now look at the first reply and many more. Is this what our union looks like to them? Jeff, do you really expect them to join us now?"
I'm going to speculate and state that where Jeff is at, it's not so parochial. I think at one time, decades ago, it was the same here. So, those that are in the know,that are in those power chairs there on Ajo Way, are you REALLY looking out for the best interests of the membership? Be honest; tell us why you think you are. Try to use your own words; not those of YouTube in drafting your answer.
So, unionists, when those in your own flock make comments like the last one quoted, you really need to ask yourselves that question.
What are those comments like over there on the 'members only board' anyway? Should we start posting some of them here??
"You are wrong. Your couple of hundred signatures isn't a start, it's the end. The end of the road for your crusade. You made big promises, and you couldn't deliver."
Patience is a virtue; something you don't know a lot about.
Didn't Morpheus just get promoted? Who saya they are not promoting?
"Didn't Morpheus just get promoted? Who saya they are not promoting?"
Well apparently the ousties can't get promoted because I know one of my co workers just got promoted to salary a week ago with another to follow shortly.
"What are those comments like over there on the 'members only board' anyway? Should we start posting some of them here??"
maybe we should wait a few more weeks before starting those posts
Anonymous said...
"What are those comments like over there on the 'members only board' anyway? Should we start posting some of them here??"
maybe we should wait a few more weeks before starting those posts"
Pish Posh Post away!
Here post this.......
SUCKERS!!!!!!
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“You pissed off a whole lots of people,you think a little hats off or look at your leaders will take away the fact nobody likes you or wants to play nice to you? It don't matters where you go,nobody likes peoples like you you are just mean.”
I love how you blame on the victim. You loudmouths hated us before we organized. And it backfired. Nobody likes Parti boy? What planet are you on? He has lots of friends. They are not fair weather friends like yours. They don’t judge people by union ideas. We’re happy your type doesn’t like us. It’s a badge of honor. In defeat, we stand strong. You tried to abuse us, and we stood firm. Why don’t you go back and read what Superbia wrote since 07 instead of making claims like “You pissed of a whole lot of people”. It’s time you make peace.
Anyone going to the U of A game tonight?
Anyone gotten a questionnaire about things the Union should fight for this round? Should those questions get asked here?
It is apparent by the quality of the Pro Union comments made here that the real loser is the hourly employees.
God help us all!
"It is apparent by the quality of the Pro Union comments made here that the real loser is the hourly employees.
God help us all!"
Exactly, we Pro unioners are horrible! I'm sorry and may God have mercy on my soul for picking the wrong side of the fight.
G*d forgives; some on the pro-union side (n fact, some of the leadership) see that forgiveness is a sign of weakness and impairment.
"Anonymous said...
Anyone gotten a questionnaire about things the Union should fight for this round? Should those questions get asked here?
Sep 12, 2009 12:15:00 PM"
Some issues (9/80,Rona,GWI)have been hand delivered already. If you have more specific please include details.It will be looked at.
I would like to see 9/80s offered just like salaried. Period. Same offer, take it or leave it and work 5-40s. A decision between supervisor and employee. Unions fought years for the 5-40, the law is set. Now let workers decide for themselves. Let the Union step aside on 9-80 until needed again.
What says the Union?
"I would like to see 9/80s offered just like salaried. Period. Same offer, take it or leave it and work 5-40s. A decision between supervisor and employee. Unions fought years for the 5-40, the law is set. Now let workers decide for themselves. Let the Union step aside on 9-80 until needed again.
What says the Union?"
I will ask the negotiating team at tomorrows union meeting and let you know. It is my understanding that a negotiated agreement applies to all of the hourly and cannot be separated on specific items like work week schedules. So if we get 9/80, we all get it,no choice between supervisors and employee.
"G*d forgives;"
Yes I understand because I've read a bit of the bible and I've been to a service or two.
"some on the pro-union side (n fact, some of the leadership) see that forgiveness is a sign of weakness and impairment."
You could be right and I think everyone thanks you for your wonderful insight and lack of intelligence for such a dumb statement.
RONA needs to be left to company and employee. Union deals as company does it for salary. Dont ruin it like last time.
Same with 9/80. That's BS the Union has all or none 9/80. Give each employee choice. What happend to "freedom?"
Hands off the 9/80s! Give it JUST like salary! Dont puss out and ask the international. Just DO IT!
"RONA needs to be left to company and employee. Union deals as company does it for salary. Dont ruin it like last time.
Same with 9/80. That's BS the Union has all or none 9/80. Give each employee choice. What happend to "freedom?"
Hands off the 9/80s! Give it JUST like salary! Dont puss out and ask the international. Just DO IT!"
Hang on a second here, You guys have been quoting all of these links and labor laws etc... I'm no expert but even I know it's called "Collective" bargaining for a reason. So that all are treated equal hence collective. It has nothing to do with what the leaders want but what the membership votes for or against. Negotiating different terms for even 2-300 out of 1750 is against the NLRB laws when dealing with a collective bargaining agreement(cba). The company nor the union can do that. Even flex start times have a limit and are bound to everyone in the hourly ranks. I am not against what you propose, I just don't know how it all will work. But it will be presented to the negotiators for you.
"Give each employee choice. What happend to "freedom?"
This is why it was stressed to join and have a vote. The Collective Bargaining Unit (hourly union members) are the ones who decide. Everything you want might get negotiated but if 1200 say no, it won't happen. The upside of that is, I don't know very many members who wouldn't vote for something that is a benefit to them. The big question is, will the company actually be willing to even discuss it. Unless Bob Guth has told you something we don't know about or you got something in writing , I wouldn't trust him to walk my mother across the street.
Personally I don't want 9/80. With kids in school and sports I like to leave at 2.30 to pick them up or go to their practices. 9/80 does not work for everyone.
TO: Sep 12, 2009 10:25:00 PM
Is it possible to collectivly bargain to let each employee decide if he or she wants 9/80 just like salary? This would become a non issue fast if the company wants it, so do we! Let each section offer a deal just like the salaried folks. the worker takes it or leaves it. If they leave it, then continue working just like always. This is such a no brainer.
Free Choice Act
"I will ask the negotiating team at tomorrows union meeting and let you know. It is my understanding that a negotiated agreement applies to all of the hourly and cannot be separated on specific items like work week schedules. So if we get 9/80, we all get it,no choice between supervisors and employee."
Be sure to bring proof of that statement, please. Would like everyone to be able to read that piece of labor law; I don't think it's there.
Go ask some of the other shops that have hourly employees about alternate work week schedules - as you know, 9/80 is but one of them.
It really is simple, as others have mentioned. Twice a year, you get to decide your schedule, then you stay on it.
I'm here to tell ya, where the hang up will be is on overtime issues, especially in the 'short' weekend.
"G*d forgives; some on the pro-union side (n fact, some of the leadership) see that forgiveness is a sign of weakness and impairment."
Sep 12, 2009 4:28:00 PM
Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone.
When the dust settles, the workers will see that this is the best thing to happen to the workers in over fifty years.
That last set of comments looks like the handy work of The Union Treasurer, Ramon "Agent Smith" Rodriguez. To the membership out there: Would you vote for That Man??
"That last set of comments looks like the handy work of The Union Treasurer, Ramon "Agent Smith" Rodriguez. To the membership out there: Would you vote for That Man??"
First of all dickweed! do you blame Ramonforall your ills? Including hemmroids?Bad breath? itchy ass? Get a clue!
Secondly Did you get my vote?
He got mine!!!!
Can you get something back that you would no longer accept, unless it was negotiated? Hourly and salaried received performance sharing for the first few years and then bobby martinez wrote an article in the union newsletter Is "Results Sharing" What You Want? performance sharing was then shunned unless a joint team, company and union effort was set down. The company said take "what is offered" and they were not going to allow the union to peruse the financial books. The RONA was gone!!?!?! So maybe begging to get it reinstated might help. By the way why do all you people love your scooby snacks(gumball coins) and employee of the month, so much? It wasn't negotiated, it's not fair, it's favoritism.
"So maybe begging to get it (RONA) reinstated might help."
Oh, no they won't; they'll want a GWI over RONA.
How many years has there been NO RONA given to the salaried - anyone here have a guess??
Isn't RONA kinda like a SWP? Hell, 933 coudn't do that right, either!
"By the way why do all you people love your scooby snacks(gumball coins) and employee of the month, so much? It wasn't negotiated, it's not fair, it's favoritism."
What?!
Rewarding the people that do well, are team players, working toward the common goal of warfigher support!
Why, that's blasphemy to a unionist, isn't it?!
F the company, F the world, F the warfighter, all for me me me!!
On another topic:
Has anyone communicated with H-D about the use of the bar and shield? Did IAM's lawyers clear that through the Motor company's lawyers?
I've got $100 for the first person that has a good, clear picture of that so it can be sent to them to see if it's legal.
Any takers?
"do you blame Ramonforall your ills? "
Looks to me like someones nerves got touched. You write like him, you say like him. Either you're him or you are his intimate brother.
"Has anyone communicated with H-D about the use of the bar and shield? Did IAM's lawyers clear that through the Motor company's lawyers?
I've got $100 for the first person that has a good, clear picture of that so it can be sent to them to see if it's legal.
Any takers?"
Well? Is it true that this union also ripped-off H-D's intellectual property?
In the event you thought I'm pulling a wet string:
HD vs Grottanelli
So, to keep the union's hands clean, better rat out who designed and printed those shirts.
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